June 29, 2021

BONUS: A Ted Lasso Barbecue Special (with Adrian Miller & Brendan Curran)

It's all Ted Lasso BBQ with BBQ Historian Dr. Adrian Miller and Coach Brendan Curran, who makes the shirts Jason Sudeikis wears on the show.


Welcome back to the Crown & Anchor, Greyhounds! On this bonus episode, Christian and Brett have not one, but two conversations about one of Ted Lasso's favorite things in the whole wide world: BARBECUE!

Our first conversation is with Adrian Miller, aka the Soul Food Scholar. Adrian is an author and speaker who drops barbecue knowledge like hot biscuits. We spoke with Adrian about the cultural and historical origins of barbecue in America and discussed the barbecue scene's latest efforts to pay homage to its rich and diverse past.

Our second conversation is with Brendan Curran, the owner of the clothing company Three KC. He created the Joearthur Gatestack t-shirt that Ted Lasso loves to wear when he gets all comfy in the evenings. We talked with Brendan about his company and what it's been like to see an uptick in business after his merch featured so prominently in the show, and after his products received glowing recommendations from famous Lasso superfans like Brené Brown and Jen Hatmaker. He and Christian also shared their favorite dishes at some of KC's most famous BBQ joints.

Consider this your warning that this episode may induce meat sweats and involuntary drooling.

Discussed On This Episode

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A full transcript of this episode can be found here.

Richmond Til We Die is a conversation about the Apple TV+ show Ted Lasso. A place where fans (and curious newcomers) come together to discuss the characters, their relationships to each other, and how they're able to make us laugh until we can hardly breathe one minute and then feel with the deepest parts of our hearts the next. When you're here, you're a Greyhound!

Transcript

Brett   
Hey Christian, have you smoked in a good meat lately?

Christian  
Oh, indeed it is peak smoking season sweet.

Brett   
Is there a way that I could sample some of this delicious barbecue and then leave a rating or review somewhere.

Christian  
I'm not sure there's an easy way for you to do that. But there is an easy way that you can leave a rating and review for our podcasts. If you have access to an Apple device. You can find our show by searching Richmond till we die. Then you can scroll to the bottom of the Show page and tap that five star button and write a nice little note sharing what you enjoy about the show.

Brett   
Okay, that sounds easy enough. But

Christian  
what if I don't have an Apple device? If you don't have an Apple device, the next best thing to do is create a free account on pod chaser and leave a rating and review for our show@www.hp pod chaser.com.

Brett   
All right, well, in the immortal words, well, I am Apple D and the rest of the black IPS. Let's get it started up in here. Enjoy the episode y'all.

Christian  
Welcome to the crown and anchor greyhounds. This is a bonus episode of Richmond till we die a conversation about the Apple TV plus show Ted lasso, where we explore the characters, their relationships to each other, and how they're able to make us laugh until we can hardly breathe One moment. Deal with the deepest parts of our hearts the next. I'm Christian, and this episode is my Super Bowl.

Brett   
I'm Brett and I am already drooling all over my microphone because this episode features not one, but two conversations about one of Ted lassos favorite things. barbecue.

Christian  
Our first conversation is with Dr. Adrian Miller aka the soul food scholar. We hit up Adrian to school us on the roots of barbecue and to discuss the eraser of black folks role during this period of barbecue gentrification. He takes us back way back back into time to help us understand some of the roots of barbecue in Kansas City, including Ted lassos. Beloved Arthur Bryant's

Brett   
in our second conversation is with Brendan Curran. Brendan is the owner of three KC the shirt company that makes that Joe Arthur gate stack t shirt that Ted lasso is so fond of sleeping in. We chatted with Brendan about his company, his wisdom as a coach and entrepreneur, and what we need to know when we walk into the best barbecue joints in Kansas City. We also got the lowdown on how an off the cuff joke from his childhood buddy Jason Sudeikis inspired the now famous shirts. We hope y'all enjoyed this episode. Please be aware that you may experience Phantom meat sweats and the distinct fragrance of a barbecue smoker in action. While listening to this episode. You've been warned. Now, let's get into our first conversation with barbecue historian, scholar and enthusiast Adrian Miller.

Christian  
Thank you so much for joining us today. I think one of the most difficult parts about this interview is going to be for us to not drill through the whole thing as we think about all of our lovely barbecue memories. In your book, black smoke, you started that book as a way to tell the story of the black roots of barbecue in the US. But once you got into it, you ended up going all the way back to Native American history. How did that come about? And what are a couple of the most interesting things you learned that you could share with our listeners?

Adrian Miller  
Well, fellas, I am a seeker of Truth. So I was just trying to figure out our early barbecue history because it is hazy. Because you know, there wasn't a lot of documentation. And then what is documented, the people who were writing it weren't always good at describing what they did, they were often incomplete. And then quite a few times they had an agenda. So they distorted what they saw. And so to me barbecue has three kind of main groups of characters, you've got Native Americans, you've got the Europeans who come to the Americas, and then you've got enslaved Africans later enslaved African Americans. And of those three casts of characters, two of those groups rely on oral traditions. So they don't come from literary traditions where you would write stuff down. So that makes it all tricky. But you know, the, the, the story of the Caribbean origin of barbecue and how to got to the American South never quite made sense to me. Because what you see Columbus and crew witnessing in the, you know, late 15th century was cooking over a raised platform matchsticks over a slow fire with you know, fish iguanas, maybe some plants on it, which is very different than the trench barbecue that emerges in the American South, you know, cooking whole animals over a trench filled with hardwood holes. So I was just trying to figure out that story. And what I did is I took a look at Native American meat smoking techniques, what Europeans wrote about at the time of exploration when they were going through the American South, and they tried to figure out okay, well, how did we get from what Native Americans were doing to what we call barbecue and my feet Now not everybody buys this one but my theory is that Southern barbecue emerges as a hybrid of kind of Native American techniques with a shallow pit combined with European kind of quick grilling traditions and then African sensibilities, he was smoking and seasoning,

Christian  
Ted Lasso focuses on Kansas City barbecue because Jason Sudeikis is from the Kansas City area and two of the restaurants that make an appearance there that have roots in the black community are Arthur Bryant's AND Gates barbecue, and Arthur Bryant's makes some appearances on it's like the background on telesis computer and he gets Arthur Bryant's sauce from his family as a care package over to England. But there's a guy if we rewind back a little further in history, named Henry Perry, who's considered the father of Kansas City barbecue, and who kind of birthed both Arthur Bryant's AND Gates, who was he and how did he get that title?

Adrian Miller  
Yeah, he's a fascinating guy. So he comes from West Tennessee. And he arrives in Kansas City, and he was a porter. At first, he wasn't really making barbecue as a profession, but at some point, he starts selling barbecue out of a part in an alley. And he was calling himself the king of barbecue. And if you start reading these historical sources, man, a lot of these dudes are bragging about being the kings of barbecue. I mean, there were as many as there are princes in Saudi Arabia. And you know, the Nigerian ones asking me for money all over the place. And so he starts to get a brick and mortar location by the 1910s. And he's putting in newspaper ads. But yeah, he's the guy who was really considered as one of the best people making barbecue. He wasn't the first because if you go back and look at newspapers and other things, there are clearly other people who are making barbecue and even some of them were calling themselves the king of barbecue. But I think he just did it the best. And he cultivated a clientele customers. And he was really savvy. And in my book, I was really happy to track down one of his earliest newspaper advertisements. And man, Henry, everything showed up on his menu. I mean, we think we can see these just ribs, brisket, chicken sausage, but dude had groundhog, possum, wild game, all kinds of stuff like that. So it was definitely an eclectic menu. And he offered to smoke anybody who was a hunter, he would smoke their food. And we know that he taught the Bryant brother brothers Arthur and Charlie, how to cook and others. There's a whole kind of coaching tree, just from Henry Perry. So I think that's why he's definitely called the father of Kansas City barbecue.

Christian  
And you shared just there about some of his entrepreneurial skills. In your book, black smoke, you have an entire chapter on entrepreneurship. What was it about barbecue that provided so many business opportunities for folks in the black community at a time where those were few and far between?

Adrian Miller  
Yeah, you know, I think one thing that was key was that African Americans had a competitive advantage, because so many people believed that African Americans were the best ones to make barbecue. And part of this is because of the long association of blackness and barbecue that stems from slavery. Barbecue was very hard work. And so these gargantuan barbecues, with 1000s of people that was only possible with enslaved labor. And so by the time you get to the 1850s, I mean, even the 1830s, you've got newspaper articles about what's authentic barbecue happening all across the United States. And they're saying, well, you gotta have a negro man or a colored man do this. So that's how identified so part of its competitive advantage. The other part is that low barrier to entry. I mean, some of these early barbecue, quote, unquote businesses, was a dude would just dig a hole out in the woods, and cook a pig and people just knew where to go. And he sold that until he ran ran out. And then he got if he got fancy, he put a shed, you know, like something, he built some kind of stand, so you could have some shade. And so these are the earliest iterations of the barbecue restaurant, but I think, you know, health regulations weren't then what they are now. So you know, people would even sell barbecue out of their house, they would just dig a hole in the lawn. So I think that was a part of it. And then, you know, if you know what you're doing is not an expensive thing to do, as long as you can get that paid. But as long as you don't have to manage fire and other things, you know, you could make eke out a decent living.

Christian  
And we should know, Henry Perry, there were times where he would open up his establishment and feed people for free like, in the 1000s of people and he talked about it as almost like a calling from God or passing on that blessing. And so the entrepreneurship was big, but also the sense of community was huge in those early days of barbecue.

Adrian Miller  
Yeah, I love that. You see that throughout time with barbecue entrepreneurs, you know, feeding on less fortunate providing food for the civil rights movement for act, you know, people working for social justice. So there is a humanitarian slash social justice vibe. And I love that.

Christian  
One of the big themes and Ted Lascaux is barbecue sauce, he gets it in a care package from his family, one of the more iconic scenes in the show, he kind of like calls his shot and his, quote unquote, homerun shot is to say, barbecue sauce before he hits a bull's eye. And in your book, you have an entire chapter on the primacy of sauce in African American barbecue. And you talk a little bit too about just kind of your journey and how you've come to see sauce as a judge and as a kind of sewer. What were the roots of barbecue sauce in the community? And how does that differ from how sauce is viewed now?

Adrian Miller  
Yeah. So you know, if you go back to old school, barbecue sauce was integral, and sauce, quote, unquote, back in those days was vinegar or red pepper. And so as the meat is cooking, periodically, they would be dabbed with this sauce. And so sauce really wasn't a condiment, right? It was part of the cooking process. And I know a lot of people have an attitude about Carolina barbecue today, because they just say, oh, let's do vinegary. But uh, I would just submit, if you actually get barbecue from a Carolina person who knows what they're doing, the vinegar adds such a depth of flavor, it really is just really a great thing. So you start out with these vinegar sauces. And then eventually tomatoes get added. And so it puts us more on the road to the bull we think of as barbecue sauce today. And so it's been a huge part of African American culture. In fact, most people would tell you that anybody can cook the meat is just the sauce. That's really this thing. This distinguishes you and your calling card. And I don't know if you've ever noticed this. But if you sit down with a barbecue person, and ask them how they cook, the me, they usually will tell you everything. But then you ask what's in your sauce, then it's in the vault, right? They clam up. I don't know if you noticed that. And I've been I've been African American Red places where I got my barbecue and the plate was an ocean of sauce with little islands of meat poking through. So that just shows you how important sauces So the one thing that gets on my nerves with kind of barbecue talks today is there's an emerging conventional wisdom that good barbecue was unsourced. Because the sauce hides imperfections in the meat or in the cooking where the meat was cooked, or you want to taste the meat. And that's one way to make barbecue. But I'm telling you, for a lot of people, the sauce complements it. And it's the calling card for a lot of barbecue cooks.

Christian  
I'm guilty as charged on the low low sauce philosophy. I get a little offended when people come to my house and bury bury the meat I've painstakingly cooked in sauce. So Allah, I'll be more gracious to them now.

Brett   
Can I check your heart?

Christian  
Yep, yep. One of the barbecue restaurants in Kansas City that doesn't make the show. But you have talked about being one of your kind of favorites in your Pantheon is LC's barbecue in Kansas City? How would you describe the LC's experience?

Adrian Miller  
Oh, man, I would describe it as old school brother. So you know, and LC Richardson passed away, I think a couple months ago. So he rest in peace. But when he was there, you know, you'd come in and he was kind of off at this table on the side. A lot of times he was probably sleeping. It depends on you know how what stage of his career you got there. But you got this massive brick pit, right with the doors. And you can see the magic going in and out of that. And so you just kind of sense that you're just leaving was like, looking back in time almost. You're getting old school barbecue, and a lot of people loved his burnt ends, I really liked his slice pork, which is not something you see in a lot of places. And from what I understand, the family is still keeping the restaurant going and they haven't missed a beat. So that's really good to hear. Because a lot of times when the you know, the longtime owner dies, things drop off, and sometimes it closes. But yeah, it's just like a small place. Not too fancy, dominated by that brick pit. And then you said Mr. Richardson, just kind of off on the side. You know, when you did engage a man he was he was very friendly, he would talk to you. And I just always liked that about him. And my sense about lcsw is it's a place that locals know, but a lot of people outside of Kansas City don't. That's my sense. Yeah,

Christian  
never a huge weight there. One of the cool things about LC's is it's one of the closest places to the football stadium and the baseball stadium, if you kind of go up the back way. And so there will be times where we would go to a baseball game, and we'd stopped by LC's and like you'd get your food and and they'd wrap it up and then you could take it in tailgate and eat at the parking lot have really good barbecue without all of the effort and it would still be hot. So you know, I think latos kind of it was a life hack to hit up LC's on the way to the Royals games or the Chiefs games and I did That pit is amazing because as you order and stand in front of the cashier, they're opening and closing the pit. So as you're trying to figure out what you want, you can see exactly how everything looks. And the other thing that that's amazing. The other characteristics of LC's is that it had the most endearingly endearingly slippery floor of any barbecue place that I've ever been in. And I just I love that about lcsw, you have quite a bit of experience in the competition, barbecue community, you're a certified barbecue judge. And one of the things that you noticed and called that community to account on was kind of the lack of diversity, and the sense that it wasn't super welcoming to people of color. And at one point in time, you wrote a piece in the Kansas City Star that explains some of these things. What was the response that you got from the barbecue community? After you wrote that high profile piece?

Adrian Miller  
Yeah, you know, I was good. I just expected a lot of people to come at me. Because, you know, just a lot of people don't want to hear anything about race. And you don't want to hear be criticized. But the piece you're referring to as a criticism of the American Royals, barbecue Hall of Fame, which at that time when I wrote that it was 90%, white, maybe even more than 90%. And the only black inductee at that point was Henry Perry, who, you know, deserved to be in it. But compared to all these other people, we talked about Roger Bryant, we've talked about, you know, the gates family, you're going to tell me that Henry Ford and guy fury should get inducted to for those guys do? And that's what happened. Yeah. What? Yes. Well, yeah, so to the American Royals credit, you know, initially, I got kind of, you know, a tepid response. But later, I got invited to be on the board. And so I'm part of the process and now selecting the finalists to be inducted, and then it's up to other people to vote. And I'm very pleased to say that we've had very diverse classes. And this year, Arthur Bryant, and Ollie gates will be inducted.

Christian  
That's awesome as they should be. One last question was we kind of record this society is starting to get going again, there was a point when you were researching for this book, you were definitely one of my favorite Twitter accounts, because you were going all over the country, and trying all of these different barbecue places. And you were like tweeting out the pictures of your meals as you did all this research. And I remember being super jealous, because you like needed a research assistant, and I wasn't at the place in life where I could follow you around the country and eat barbecue with you. But how did you sustain yourself for this last year when a lot of restaurants weren't open?

Adrian Miller  
Yeah. So you know, being in Denver, what I did is I tried to get as much takeout as I could to sustain these places. Because I knew the tremendous curveball that they were thrown. And I knew that it was a matter of survival for a lot of them. And unfortunately, my favorite black owned place in Denver did close. They just couldn't they just hemorrhaging cash. So yeah, I tried to support the community. And a lot of people in Denver food media asked me to name my favorite spots. So I tried to give as many places love as I could, so that people would support these places. And so it was tough, man, it was really tough. But yeah, as long as people are, as we're reopening, people will just make a point to support these businesses and, you know, ease up on the Yelp reviews. Even if you have a bad experience, you know, we're just, it's just not about that right now. These places need help, and they need to get back. So let's just let's just have a little love and grace, and help these places get there. And then you know, a year from now you can put them on blast. So let's just let's let's let's help them out for right now.

Brett   
Good energy only.

Christian  
Yeah, good energy, only love and grace and full bellies. That's all we need. Well, we are super appreciative of you giving us the time today and the knowledge and the wisdom and the experience. definitely encourage everybody to pick up black smoke and to head over to your website as well to check out all of your books and the products that you offer. And to give you a follow on Twitter because it's one of the most delicious and educational accounts that you'll find. Thank you so much for joining us today. Oh, so great to be with you. Thanks for the invitation. Yeah, thanks again. Peace.

Brett   
A big thank you again to our first guest Adrian Miller for sharing his expert barbecue knowledge in our first conversation. Coming up next, our conversation with Brendan Curran, an entrepreneur, high school teacher and basketball coach. Brendan is the owner of the clothing brand Three KC and the creator of the show or their Joe Bryant Gatestack shirt Ted lasso is so fond of wearing in the series. Welcome Brendan. We are so glad to have you here with us today.

Brendan Curran  
I'm honored to be here.

Christian  
For the listeners we connected with Brendon online when I saw it, the Joe Arthur gate stack shirts in the show, I immediately knew something was up because I was recognizing how the titles of the barbecue restaurants were kind of mashed up. And so we went and found his company 3KC, and then reached out to him via email. And he's been cool to come on. And now visit with us about just the process of the merchandise and the experience of those creations and what it's been like. So before we get stuck in Brendon, could you please tell the listeners about the shirt that you're wearing today?

Brendan Curran  
Yet today's shirt, I've got a Kansas City shield that I partnered with the Kansas City and the professional women's soccer team. They reached out to me they had seen Ted last on kind of just found my brain that way and asked me if I wanted to partner with them and to do a little collaboration. So it was one of those happy accidents. This this design I'm wearing. This is not one that I envisioned when I started it just kind of happened. And it turned out pretty cool. And so yeah, they are selling it at the stadium on game days and selling it in their online store. And it's Yeah, it's been a fun little partnership for me.

Christian  
Yeah, that's been a cool story for Kansas City this year, they lost their NWSL team a few years ago. And then now we're able to get a different franchise and some local business people have come and taken it up and really supported it. And they seem to be going about it the right way, and really investing in the community from the ground up. So I love that they're partnering with Kansas City entrepreneur and you guys are able to work together. 

Brett   
You were kind enough to send us some 3KC merchandise just out of the goodness of your heart. And we were so excited when it got here. It's probably been here over a week and I've worn my shirt four times already. It's so comfortable. And this is one of the special Ted lasso you know, partnership ones, right? It's a it has the little pop art like Ted lassos face with the mustache and the visor and the glasses. And then it says Be curious, not judgmental, and it's a dark navy blue solid shirt. I love it.

Brendan Curran  
Yeah, so the the beat curious, not judgmental. So when that line got delivered in the show, it just struck me at my core because that's totally my dad. And it's my dad has been battling, you know, his Lewy body dementia, and he passed away this April. And so that that T shirt has really been a special one to me. And I think you've got Is there a TLC? Yes,

Brett   
Yes, there is.

Brendan Curran  
Yeah. So that's, that's the little special one I added after my dad passed away. Those are my dad's initials. Oh, and I just kind of hit it in there. You know, I don't know if people thought it would be a Ted Lasso Club or whatever. For TLC. 

Brett   
That's a good easter egg. Because I was like, I don't know if it's like Ted Lasso  collaboration or what? So that's, that's great.

Brendan Curran  
Yeah, those are my dad's initials. That's that statement. You know, when I first watched the show last summer, I mean, it just struck me I'm like, Oh, my gosh, that is my dad. So you know, he was a journalist his whole life. And I was asking people's questions getting their story. So yeah, that's that shirts a special one to me, for sure.

Christian  
That is a great and fun legacy. Like what a cool way to be able to honor your dad and yeah, yeah, joyful way to like it's right, a good time in history to find ways to celebrate people. So I'm glad. I'm glad you're able to do that. And thanks for sharing that with us. Yeah. Yeah. So I'm curious about something. The shirts that appear in the show a handful of times they say, Joe Arthur gates stack and being the Kansas City barbecue person I am I was immediately curious because I recognized that that was a combination of four iconic barbecue joints from Kansas City, Kansas City Joe's, formerly Oklahoma Joe's, Arthur Bryant's gates and jack stack. How did you come up with the idea to combine those four restaurants into a beautiful barbecue baby fashion statement?

Brendan Curran  
Yeah, the idea really was several years ago, someone had asked, Jason's today is in an interview about you know what his favorite barbecue was? And a lot of people know that you can start fights with If you answer that, people his response, I think he said Oklahoma Gates . And I thought that was really funny. And just over over time, as I started diving into doing some graphic design things, really just coming up with things for my classroom. That was one thing I started to play with a little bit. And you know, those four places are the Mount Rushmore of of Kansas City barbecue, for sure, because there's so many good ones like people like well, why didn't you include you 39 Why didn't you include so and so slaps and you know, you could go on with all the different cancers, barbecues, barbecues, but those are the Mount Rushmore for sure, you know, They are the icons. So I thought that was a fun, I did add q 39. I have a false, you know, 39 whether it was established in the year 1939 on a few designs, just because I liked them a lot, too.

Christian  
Nice. That's awesome. Good little easter egg there. That was some good diplomacy on Jason's part. I know that whenever people kind of ask me that question about my favorite, what I tell people is, I have a favorite dish from a lot of different barbecue places and so that I can kind of give them recommendations that way and spread the love. I'm going to give a quick explainer of the vibe of each of these places for our people who haven't been to KC and then after I do that, I want you to share with them what one of your favorite things is to order from that particular joint. So let's start with Kansas City Joe's used to be called Oklahoma Joe's when it was established in a gas station in Kansas City, Kansas, right near the Missouri and Kansas State line. And it was started by a group of competition cooks by the name of slaughterhouse five so when you go to Kansas City Joe's what is one of your favorite things to order?

Brendan Curran  
Yes, so it is and honestly right now just logistically, I've got one pretty close to my house so it is it's kind of my go to if we're going to get barbecue that's that's the most most that's the place I'm gonna go most often. I am typically going to go with a rib dinner rib in one mean. So you know I want to get ribs I will mix it up. Sometimes I go ribs and brisket. Sometimes I go ribs and Burnett. And I put in particular like to get my side as spicy slaw. I think it goes perfectly.

Christian  
You know, they've got some great sandwiches I typically don't go for the sandwich one I'm at Joe's. I'm just going to get you know ribbon one meat and usually pair that with extra pickles and some spicy slob nice. So if you Yeah, that's my go to for sure. If you want to go secret menu one thing that I ordered there is a pulled pork z man on Texas toast. So there's z man sandwich is usually on a bun. It's usually brisket with provolone and onion ring and barbecue sauce on there. So if you get pulled pork, it switches up the meat. If you get it on Texas toast that's on like a buttery white bread that's been toasted. And then I put the spicy slaw on top of the sandwich and just make a wonderful Kansas City Carolina. Yeah, sandwich.

Brendan Curran  
Yeah, I can totally get down with the Carolina style sandwiches. My goodness law. Yeah,

Brett   
I have. I've taken that recommendation from Christian before in Kansas City. And yeah, it does not disappoint. And I also love that there's like a secret Kurt Vonnegut referencing the creation of that. There you go. That barbecue place. Love it. Arthur Bryant's

Christian  
is quite a bit older than Kinsey Joe's. And our audience knows a little bit more about them from a discussions that we've had before. What do you like to order at Arthur Bryant's.

Brendan Curran  
You know, Arthur Bryant's. And it's actually been a while since I've been back there. But I'm usually seeking to get a huge brisket sandwich.

Christian  
If I'm in Arthur Brian's I mean, it's just solid, just get a pile of brisket. Their sauce is so good. That with rises is my Arthur Bryant's. And we know that if terrible so ever has to go vegetarian because of high cholesterol. He can just drink the sauce for breakfast or the bright sauce, smoothies, gates BBQ started by Ali gates, they have locations all over the city. And that's a place that has what you would call a vibe you walk in and the people who are behind the counter, they're essentially supposed to exuberantly speak to you. And if you're not used to kind of that exuberant African American culture, you might feel like they're yelling at you. But the minute you walk in the door, they say, Hi, may I help you, Sir, may I help you? And until you answer them, they're going to keep talking to you and try and try to assist you. So when you walk into Gates, it is good to have an order in your head or just say, I just need to see the menu. But what did you order at gates?

Brendan Curran  
Yeah, that's funny. As you know, when I was younger, it can be alarming if you if you don't know what's going on in gates that they're going to greet you that way. And I know some people can get rushed and not know what to order. And I know when I was younger, I would just go directly to beef on bond. You know, I'd almost just spit it out. But you know what, one interesting thing I not interesting but something that I wouldn't typically get at a barbecue place. at the school I used to teach that there was a gates not terribly far so if we had teacher workdays or something, you know, we head over there for lunch. And my friend john one time recommended the ham sandwich. Ah, and it's awesome. So it's not something on my radar typically to go to a barbecue place and get a ham sandwich but man, it's it's really good. That's good.

Christian  
I swear that they have the best strawberry soda of any place in America right? I think they make an extra syrupy and then also if you want to kind of have them tickle your ears, order a burnt end on bun because they have a very distinct way of calling that out to the kitchen that I really enjoy. Finally, Jack Stack is bougie BBQ. They have tablecloths and cloth napkins, they also have, I think one of the more expensive items that you can get, which is the crown beef rib, which is like, essentially, a ribeye steak or prime rib still on the bone that they smoke and bring out to the table. What do you like to get at Jack Stack?

Brendan Curran  
I usually go burn ends at Jack Stak. There's a burnt end plate. I don't remember what it was called on the menu. But it's I mean, it's fantastic. Yeah, that's Oh, and you know, actually jamstack that's been that's been a good tailgate experience. They've got a good tailgate order. So I can remember the AFC Championship game. And I guess that was 2020. Yeah, right before all the COVID stuff right before we won the Super Bowl. So that AFC Championship game, you know, it was a friend of mine was generous enough to bring me to the game. So there's four of us, there's some childhood friends of mine, and it is freezing cold. I mean, we're exposed skin was almost painful. It was so cold. But had no problem taking our gloves off to eat. We got wings and ribs. And it was, you know, it was an experience that like no other like it was freezing cold. But no problem exposing yourself to the cold eater ribs, eat our wings, crack a few beers up and before the game. It was just almost an out of body experience that whole day. And you know, jack, the jack stack tailgate certainly played a good start today. 

Christian  
These are the sacrifices that we can make for important things like goodbye. So you are a coach. And now that you have been able to enjoy title, so for a year like we have, have you used any of the wit wisdom or strategies from Ted Lasso or Coach Neard in your coaching this year?

Brendan Curran  
I wouldn't say anything specific I pulled from it. One thing I'll point out is that you know, in Coach Lasso's office, you see the John Wooden pyramid of success. And I was trying to remember that. So I've got there's this little blue wooden book. And there was an article that, well, this is a funny connection. So former basketball player of mine, he now writes for The Athletic. And he wrote an article on Ted Lassoand kind of the inspiration you know, so Jason and I played high school basketball together. And so it was kind of about our basketball coach and john wooden. And so there's this blue wooden book that I don't remember, Jason bought it for me if he said, Hey, you need to go buy this. But years ago, this is I mean, we're just out of college, probably. I bought this blue wooden book or gave it to me and I go to it to this day. And after that article came out, I pulled it out, you know, it was on my shelf at school, I pulled it out. And so as I was going through some different things, you know, it's it's such a good book, and it's not basketball. You know, in kind of the story is that, you know, we didn't get into that, that those john wooden quotes and philosophies when we're playing basketball, it was kind of post basketball. You know, when when Jason was getting into improv and comedy, that he was really point a lot of those leadership things, you know, those nice little wooden quotes and philosophies that that really applied to just life in general. So I don't have any specific coaching things I was pulling from that. But yeah, the John Wooden book definitely played an influence on how I do things in the classroom, how I try to be as a husband and a father and how I coach too.

Christian  
So it's very, that was ingrained into your leadership DNA. Right, cool. As your shirts have gained prominence, like really quickly, do you have any fun stories that have occurred as a result of them being on the show?

Brendan Curran  
You know, a few weeks ago, I was at one of my son's was at a basketball tournament, and I was wearing one of my Joe Arthur Gatestack shirts, and I'm walking by and somebody says, Hey, are you Ted Lasso fan? And I said, Yeah, I'm a real big fan. And so she she, you know, opens her jacket. She had, you know, one of the Lasso shirts, I was like, you just made my day. I said, that's, you know, that's my shirt and had a nice conversation with her about to last on. So that was a pretty fun one. You know, there's been some fun social media posts. You know, getting Brene Brown to post was huge.

Brett   
Word. And Jen Hatmaker Dang. So jealous. ,

Brendan Curran  
And I'm gonna be 100% honest, like I was not in that world. Like I was not fully aware of those two. And I'm very well aware. Once they once they shared those shirts, I saw a pretty immediate pickup.

Brett   
Well, Bene Brown is the matron saint of our show. So that's Yeah, that's a good synergy there.

Brendan Curran  
Yeah. And it's been great. I was I love you know, I definitely follow both of them now in it. So it's been, it's been fun to get introduced right away. And my brother, you know, I told I was telling one of my brothers about He's like, yeah, I didn't really know who they are. And I, he said something to his wife. And she's like, Are you crazy?

Christian  
Brene adn Jen both reccomending the show in close proximity got my wife to then get me to watch the show. So yes, we appreciate them and their enthusiasm for all things, Ted. So now your shirt. Yeah, at least at one point in time. I don't know if they still are. They were printed in North Carolina, which is great. Like you're stimulating the American economy. But North Carolina and Kansas City kind of have a barbecue rivalry Are you at all worried that they'll try to sabotage your hustle as a barbecue entrepreneur?

Brendan Curran  
No, it's not a huge worry right now. In I'll even admit, you know, there's some some Carolina style barbecue is that I very much enjoy. So I will always claim Kansas City. Always claim can't see barbecue till the day I die. But I can I can appreciate Carolina barbecue as well. Unfortunately, I'm getting some more as I'm, you know, now getting some of the shirts and some local stores shrinking and seeing I'm using a able to use a local printer for that. The North Carolina printers or print on demand service, which you know, as someone who teaches and coaches full time, you know, that's what my full time job is. Having that print on demand service is just fantastic. Because all I really just have to do make the designs, really as many as I want, and then get back to customers, but they print them they ship them. So it's kind of been the perfect. I was glad, obviously,

Christian  
Your business has evolved really quickly. Like, you know, it started as a fun thing and sort of a nice thing within Kansas City. And now it's national, like maybe even international as the show gains in popularity. And I know that we've like been a big cheerleader for you and tried to steer people toward your website, because we see other people like using the designs, what has that experience been like, as you're trying to teach and coach and be a dad and then like, your intellectual property is all over the place now, right?

Brendan Curran  
It's, it's a little frustrating, you know, initially, initially, I would contact websites reach out to them, they're like, Oh, sorry. And they'll take it off. But I think they eventually put it back on. And it's kind of hard to keep up with them. What I found interesting is, you know, kind of the the big sites, whether it's Amazon or Etsy, they don't make it super easy to report those. There's all these hoops you have to jump through. And for them, it's probably easiest, just let them still exist out there in that world that pump orders. But yeah, it's been a little frustrating. But so goes,

Christian  
I guess, I guess you know that you have former students who are journalists and spreading the title so love, like maybe you need to find a former basketball player who's a lawyer and help you out.

Brendan Curran  
Right, right. Or if you've got any listeners, any listeners out there who have better ideas, feel free to reach out to me through Instagram for the website. At the very

Christian  
least everybody should support Brendan and his endeavor at three Casey, we will link to them in the show notes. We'll shoot stuff out over our social media. And yeah, like help a guy out who's just kind of starting from the ground up and is having a lot of fun doing it, and is supporting something that we have all come to enjoy. Brandon, we appreciate your time today. We appreciate you just being open and fun and sharing with us and good luck in basketball and teaching and business.

Brendan Curran  
Thanks, guys. I'm so glad you guys had me on. It's fun. I've enjoyed listening to your podcast. So you know once you reached out, I started listening to you guys have just really,

Brett   
thanks. Thanks for them. Alright, thanks, guys.

Christian  
That's our show. We hope you enjoyed our discussions with Adrian Miller and Brendan current. You can check out the show notes for links to their websites and social media accounts, as well as the other cool stuff we mentioned in this episode. And there was a lot of cool stuff mentioned in this episode.

Brett   
We'll be back on the dog track next week with our conversation about Ted lasso episode nine. But y'all can keep the conversation going with us on Twitter and Instagram. In the meantime, our handle on both is @TedLassoPod

Christian  
This episode of Richmond Til We Die is brought to you by Gin and Kerosine Productions. It was produced by me Christian and me, Brett, Brett also edited, mixed and composed the music for this episode. If you felt enlightened or had other positive feelings about this conversation, we humbly ask that you take a moment to give our show a five star review and subscribe to our feed. It's the best and Easiest way you can show your support for the pod. Okay, I'm Christian signing off for Brett and Adrian and Brendan. Thanks for listening. Until next time, cheers, y'all.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai